Evolving the ASF Brand

https://www.endasfmascotry.com/

https://blog.nativesintech.org/apache-appropriation/

The quotes about the feather:

> This essay introduced a few examples of Indian warriors with full headdress, but what if just one feather is presented—is it sufficient to conjure images of savage warriors? Well, probably not just one feather, unless it can be associated with some other stereotypical image. In this case, what if the feather is paired with the word “Apache”?

> It is interesting that the Apache Web site provides a link to a Web site devoted to the Apache people, providing “stereotypical proof” that the feather symbol and the foundation name are designed to evoke images of the Apache people. This is all the more interesting in light of the fact that perhaps history’s most photographed Indigenous warrior—the Apache Geronimo—was not inclined to adorn himself in this fashion. In fact, even Hollywood depictions of Geronimo eschew the feather look. Yet the stereotypical image of the feathered Indian persists.

> Starting October 7, 2024, your usage of The ASF’s logo must be in compliance with the new logo and brand guidelines that will be available on our Brand Guidelines page.

If the logo is announced on 7th, how can someone be expected to adopt the new guidelines in a day. Why not just set it to 31 Oct or something? I know it wouldn’t matter in practice since ASF wouldn’t go after sites for using the old logo, but still.

But after reading this announcement, the substance is actually both meaningful and practical. Props to ASF's leaders.

> We thank Natives in Tech and other members of the broader open source community for bringing this issue to the forefront.

They asked the broader open source community, and I saw the blog post, but are the authors representative of any of the Apache tribes? It seems one obvious missing piece is the foundation reaching out to at least some of the tribes to ask them what they think about this. I am sure they did over the years but probably failed to mention it on their site. The people in these tribes are normal human beings living today [1]. You can talk with them and see what they'll say. They may well request to do away with the name and the feather, and foundation should then respect that, but they may not mind, either, or may suggest altering the logo, the description, etc.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache

* Encourage projects to go by just "Foo" rather than "Apache Foo".

* Re-release the "Apache License 2.0" as the "ASF License 2.0".

Disclosure: Although I haven't been active for years I'm a past ASF board member.

To be blunt, I think the arguments in this blog post are very weak. First of all, they completely fail to demonstrate how the name of ASF has any actual material impact on native peoples. Regardless of that glaring flaw, this piece focuses on the issue of respect for Apache culture and history. Framed another way, their thesis is that using the name of a nation for something unrelated is disrespectful, especially because this nation has suffered historical injustice.

There are a couple ironies about this argument. One being that the ASF is a widely respected organization with noble efforts. They chose the name Apache because of admirable aspects of that peoples past. This leads to positive feelings and respectfulness toward the Apache people. Another irony is their claim that a name should be off-limits for other uses or by other people is exclusionary, entitled, and childish, which paints the Apache as a people who deserve less respect.

The last thing I'll say is that their entire section about romanticization is just strange. In what world is attributing (even falsely) positive attributes to a nation/people a bad thing? They have a problem because it isn't dynamic enough? But why does historical memory have to be dynamic in the first place? I fail to see what is inherently virtuous about accurately deconstructing every topic all the time.

Judging from the referenced blogs they have a very relevant POV.

Not really a comfortable place, here on HN. A lot of unthinking racism here.