Apple iPhone 16 Pro and iPhone 16 Pro Max

It's absolutely stunning what smartphones can do these days and Apple makes an excellent product. It feels ungrateful and cynical to keep calling new models "boring".

The reality though is that normie needs were accomplished several generations ago. I'll use my girlfriend as a sample of such user.

She can't tell the difference between LCD and OLED nor would she notice Pro-motion.

You can add a million features to the camera app but she opens it and presses the shutter. Her only awareness of features is when she accidentally enables one and doesn't know how to get back.

You could set her back 8 iOS versions and she probably wouldn't notice. Because she uses none of the hundreds of features released since. Not because she dislikes them, she doesn't know they even exist.

All the spectacular advances in computing power are lost on her as this makes zero difference for the Facebook cat video group and Pinterest.

You might assume my girlfriend is perhaps lowly educated or just not tech savvy. Wrong, she's highly educated, even works in IT, although not in an engineering role. It's not that she's unable to understand the advances, she simply doesn't care.

It's becoming ever harder to justify new models for normies. Pretty much they buy the new one when the battery of their current one runs bad, typically every 3-4 years.

I think this is also why Apple put many Pro features into the regular model. Most people don't buy the pro and they're desperate for selling points in the regular model.

If the iPhone would have true user-swappable batteries, their business would collapse.

I used to obsess over megapixel count, portrait mode, FPS, lighting, and so forth, because I used to think that these amazing images would be priceless in the future. Well, the future came and went, and to me they actually ended up being worthless.

At one time I cared about other people on the Internet seeing pictures of me and my friends and family doing things and being places. Now I don't want anyone on the Internet seeing pictures like that. I especially don't want bots to scrape the photos to build a dossier on my activities that data brokers can add to my profile that they then turn around and sell to whoever's buying.

So these days I don't ever bother even taking photos of anything any more. Instead what I do is try to be 100% "in the moment." I try to notice the small details, feel the emotions, immerse myself in the experience. I look for the things that make an impression. I find that a camera will always -- I mean, always -- detract from that.

I suppose that's my way of saying that there hasn't been a camera feature for a phone that I've cared about for many years now. For me the 2017 Pixel 2 was the point where phone camera technology got "good enough" for anything I ever wanted to use it for. Which, these days, is almost nothing.

notes:

- photos/album search now includes video understanding, which imo seems very good from the first 2 examples they showed. includes scroll to exact time of the moment you describe.

- Mail and Notifications will show summaries instead of str[:x]

- Siri now knows iPhone, becomes the ultimate manual on how to use the increasingly complicated iOS 18. and can read your texts (!) to suggest actions with Personal Context Understanding (also it will try to advertise apple tv shows to you... i'm SURE it will be totally objective and aligned to your preferences amirite)

- new iphone 16 camera control button is PRIME real estate - notice how OpenAI/ChatGPT is now next to Google search, and both are secondary clicks to Apple's visual search, which comes first

- camera adds events to calendar!

- "all done on device" and on cloud (though craig doesnt say that haha)

overall i think insanely good ideas on ai + phone integrations.

Is anyone here actually excited about the features they just announced? Or are people simply upgrading because they get the latest iPhone every year or two by default?

The more things change...

[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8292029

Instead of simply asking a women what breed her dog was - he had to open a camera app on his iPhone, ask a women a permission to take a photo of the dog, wait until the AI gives him an answer...

The 13 Pro had ProMotion, 14 Pro had Dynamic Island and Always On display, the 15 Pro had USB-C and the Action Button, the 16 Pro...has maybe slightly faster AI? 4k120fps video? USB-C w/ USB 3? Not things most people would care about.

ProMotion/Always On is still limited to the Pro models which is enough to justfy the upcharge, but it's a surprise they aren't locking a new feature this time.

I actually like the idea, but I worry a lot that it will lead to non tech-savvy (and tech-savvy-but-hurried) people to getting rekt. It’s still obscene to me that they don’t show the sender’s email before clicking in. It not only removes valuable information to screen emails with, but if there are tracking pixels, they fire since you must open the email for further screening. (Sender email can ofc be spooked, but this catches most spam I get)

Every iPhone generation makes YouTube video quality slightly better as it’s what a lot of people use. That plus social media.

Camera quality is quite amazing these days

The non-techy group of friends only commented on the colors, size of the phone, and how there's nothing interesting to convince them to upgrade from the 13/14/15 models.

The nerdy group really got hyped on the Apple Intelligence part, only qualm being that it's not going to be released on day one. They also had screenshots to share of previous chips like the A16 and A17 to compare. The video specs were all followed by positive emojis because almost everyone has kids, pets, or things they like recording. And at the end, some even lamented the fact that the default storage is only 128GB on the smaller Pro model.

As someone who's very interested in smartphones, I found it kinda interesting how Apple seems to be sharing more data points on performance and specs instead of "useful features" that most people would notice.

It's been many generations since I've had an Apple device, and each year they release a new one I try figure out how long the battery lasts, to no avail. Nobody I know has bought a Max Pro either.

With Apple, you never know, it could still be 10 hours battery life. I mean they just released "ground-breaking" features like moveable icons, something I think Android had since Android 1. My point is one never knows.

Have we witnessed peak Apple?

Apple Watch: minimal updates. AirPods Max: new color. AirPods: some minor tweaks.

From [1] "Additional Apple Intelligence features will roll out later this year and in the months following", i.e. later in 2024 and then in 2025, and the not-available-at-launch features appear to be the stronger ones, e.g. ChatGPT integration?

Any word on improving the dictate-to-text keyboard feature? I could only find "In the Notes and Phone apps, users can also record, transcribe, and summarize audio", but that's different.

[1] https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2024/09/apple-debuts-iphone-1...

So, will Apple be the one to make this a new industry standard for flagship devices, like they did with the removal of the 3.5mm headphone jack or excluding the charger from the box? Perhaps, but for now, I remain cautiously skeptical.

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1. Apple hasn’t officially listed the display resolution on the iPhone 16 Pro Max’s product page, but thankfully, GSMArena has all the technical details available: https://www.gsmarena.com/apple_iphone_16_pro_max-13123.php.

2. AFAIK, aside from Samsung, only two other major brands have experimented with this display size: Motorola, with its Razr 50 Ultra (2024), and Huawei, with the Pocket (2022).

As I am on an iPhone 13 Pro Max, still in total absolutely a worthy upgrade for me. I certainly look forward to it. The advantages vs the 15 I can see so far:

- updated SOC, somewhat faster, but up to 30% more power-efficient which turns into

- larger battery life. Thats something everyone will welcome, I guess.

- better camera: 48mp wide angle, 120mm tele lens, 4k 120 Hz.

- a bit larger screen, too bad they at least didn't name any other screen enhancements

- the shutter button. A ton of functionality built into one single button. Pressure/touch sensitivity, haptical feedback. That should greatly improve its usage as a camera.

- all the AI stuff. We need to wait how it delivers, when it arrives (especially, if you are outside the US), but that could get interesting when it delivers.

While there wasn't any big surprise or outstanding change, for a year over year update a lot of things and definitely very nice for everyone with an older phone than the 15.

ProMotion, Always-on display, a bunch more resistant to fall damage, and a camera that is better, but doesn't look like a lot.

I'm a bit worried about the Apple Intelligence features, as they've been very prominent on WWDC, but were fairly toned-down today. Not much of it was shown, and they're delaying their arrival (notification summaries look great though, as a "little thing that matters").

I haven't had an Android phone in something like 10 years and I really think that Apple is about to start losing its monopoly due to the folding phones. They're the main (only?) reason to move to Android and leave the Apple ecosystem now.

The folding phone has now basically replaced my tablet, my phone, and my e-reader. It's just such a huge technological leap to just be able to open it up in the subway or in bed and get access to the massive screen on demand. It's actually much more comfortable to hold and type on this way that I'm writing this comment sitting on my couch with the phone unfolded in my hands.

Interesting to see all the rumors of a iPhone Slim / Air be nothing and I almost thought that they would do it on the Pro lineup.

People want this? My current 6.7 14promax is already in hindsight too big for single hand operation.

Realistically I'm probably skipping 16 anyway. Top end 14 is still adequate for everything I need

"Apple Intelligence" does not come to Europe and the rest of the world because of the DMA/DSA or other regulations. It doesn’t come, because language support isn’t there.

They are only announcing US English support, with some other English dialects in December: https://eu-img-cdn.livecenter.com/lc-images-2021/lcimg-72ed0...

And the list of proposed languages coming sometimes in 2025 is rather anaemic: https://eu-img-cdn.livecenter.com/lc-images-2021/lcimg-8aec0...

Granted, Silicon Valley companies are mostly rather bad when it comes to other languages (and even more other cultures), but Apple in the last decade tried at least and language support for Siri, dictation and such had in the past much fuller lists of language support. When was the last time they had to pad an extra slide with different variants of English [1]? When did they had to put Spanish, the quasi second language of the US, into next year? And missing from the next year slide are major languages like Arabic, Japanese, German, Italian, Hindi and a lot of more languages Siri already could do, although badly.

Maybe the new LLM/ML training for "Apple Intelligence" needs far more data, bigger data sets and that's why?

[1] Normally I would have thought of a slide with english dialects as a good thing. Computer language systems should recognize that the English language is different in different countries, that different English-speaking cultures are different and I'd argue even "UK English" is far to wide for that country of dozens of vastly different dialects. And of course the biggest English dialect is missing: "English as a second/nth language" or better "English with an accent".

I’m using my action button, I like being able to assign it to ProCamera, but it’s not as useful as it could be. I miss Touch ID.

I’m not sure why but Face ID fails for me quite often. Maybe 25% of the time. I have to make a real effort to ensure it works. Straighten out my glasses, hold the phone up and look straight into the camera, ensure good lighting, etc.

Though sometimes it will randomly work in nearly pitch black conditions. How the hell? I miss Touch ID.

I currently use ChatGPT for it’s accurate speech recognition then copy/paste into iMessage.

Expecting ground-breaking new features every year is a bit crazy, unless there is a new breakthrough like solid state batteries. Like what's going to be there next year? Flush side buttons to make the phone thinner? Why not apply all those additions in a single iteration and wait 3-4 years to come up with a next major upgrade? Consumers are not dumb anymore and can see through their marketing gimmicks

[1] https://archive.is/uQszo

I do love the colors on the regular models though!

The camera button/gesture thing on this new model seems decent but none of the features really seem that compelling to upgrade, the "visual intelligence" which is supposedly reserved for the 16 models just seems like Google Lens with maybe tighter integration with the OS features.

Additonally the 16 doesn't have more RAM which I thought they might have done given the local LLM models, so not really a compelling upgrade.

To me the old iphones with 4" screens were a good start, and I was hoping they'd get smaller and lighter as the tech got better... an iPhone 5 was 3.95oz, now iphones weigh 6-7 ounces.

My language was not even mentioned yesterday (italian)

[1] https://www.macrumors.com/2024/09/09/apple-discontinues-ipho...

I just upgraded to an iPhone 15 pro from an iPhone 13 pro a few months ago.

Honestly, I felt like the iPhone 13 pro had better battery life.

My friend confirmed the same thing between a regular iPhone 14 and iPhone 14 Pro.

Not sure if it is software or hardware or both.

Up to 33 hours video playback on iPhone 16 Pro Max8

Up to 27 hours video playback on iPhone 16 Pro8

This is pretty insane to me. For a $1,000 device to limit itself like that seems crazy. iPads have up to 16 GB, so it's obviously useful. From games to the browser - and especially on-device AI and ML - they all could use way more RAM.

Apple's tech decisions are always an enigma.

What’s even crazier is I am tempted by the pixel fold — that looks amazing for content consumption which is what I use my phone for the most.

there's just not much new going on. small improvements here and there..

i have a ton of options for my phone, special settings, options to download other apps, to further add new features

and i will probably never bother. i wanna use my phone as little as possible

Yes, there is an audience that want more and more camera, and the pro caters to that. For a lot of people they just want a pretty good camera that they can quickly capture their memories with, they don't really care for the phone to be wrapped in a camera with a dedicated button etc. I also think in terms of all the AI image processing vs. just giving a natural image the quality peaked at the iPhone 13.

I think the camera button is neat, and of course no one is going to avoid an iPhone because of it, but I don't know if it's really going to drive sales more any other small iteration would. Again, the innovation continues to comes from software features.

17 might, as it would indicate Apple is taking a breath.

Or, of course, we'll never get a supercycle again till someone iphones the iPhone.

That would be a flex.

Sure, I understand people have different needs from mine and appreciate they have a choice, but it saddens me that I don't anymore, and all I want is a modern (read: not discontinued), compact device that can do what a 10-year-old smartphone could do and gets out the way.

They even invited “Mother Earth” herself to their last presentation to talk about how much they care about the planet! Were they just lying to our faces then?

But I know what Steve Jobs would have said to this. Just go up and ask the girl what breed her dog is, and get to know her.

Was hoping for: "We peaked last year, this iPhone is slightly worse in all dimensions compared to last year."

Disappointed.

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Hm, Death Stranding in the official article? :DDDDDDD

They want you to put even more of your life on your phone but the security is just smoke and mirrors.

The 16 Pro is larger and heavier than the 15 pro which is already heavy.

I have small hands, I want a smaller and lighter phone.

Not going to buy the 16 because of lack of ProMotion.

LOL. Glad I grabbed a Mini before they was discontinued.

One is addiction (deaddiction mindset is becoming a thing) and the next is the fanboism (understandable and unstandable) which actually creates more aversion than anything!

While there is nothing wrong, the price to value justification is a like vampirism and surrounding ecosystem and hardware and specs are fine, but the real value of everything that is present is not realised by everyone.

Honestly people, how many of the actual iphone users even look at the photos taken in the phone after a day or two? probably 0.0001% (who may be pros who wants to make a statement and probably help fuel the hype for the company!) or some professionals who are stuck (sucked into) the ecosystem (for whatever non-debatable and (some good) reasons!). For the rest, it's a pride to own something costly! That's it. There you go... I said it.

It's like I'm owning a device which most people can't afford and I think I'm super and standout,but in reality, it's such a self obsessed and narcissistic feeling and nothing else!

It's their marketing and product placement and business tactics.

I just need a compact phone for making calls and don't want a device which I will proudly show in front of my face wherever and whenever possible... That's really annoying.

Good that I moved away from Apple ecosystem completely and I'm still alive.

Just too much hyped year after year...

That's the case with most manufacturers and just not these guys!

... gosh.

For all the discussion, this was so mid it hurts.

I feel like people are poking the product release with a stick. C’mon. Do something.

Thanks Greg, that's very helpful information.

is there a word for this...marketing inflation in lieu of innovation.

apple used to be a tech company supported by marketing. now its a marketing company supported by tech.